[j-nsp] Juniper MPC2E-3D-NG-R-B vs MPC2E-3D-R-B

[Kevin Wormington]

Hi list,

Can anyone tell me the differences in scaling or features of the MPC2E-3D-NG-R-B vs MPC2E-3D-R-B. I know the NG requires an SBCE2.

Thanks,

Kevin
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[Rolf Hanßen]

Hello,

as far as I see the feature difference is HQoS:
https://www.juniper.net/documentation/en_US/release-independent/junos/topics/reference/general/mpc-mx-series-mpc2e-features.html

regards
Rolf

Post by Kevin Wormington
Hi list,
Can anyone tell me the differences in scaling or features of the
MPC2E-3D-NG-R-B vs MPC2E-3D-R-B. I know the NG requires an SBCE2.
Thanks,
Kevin
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[Saku Ytti]

Hey Rolf,

No that's not it, that's difference between Q and non Q card. All
three generations had HQoS support:

1) MPC (Trio 1.0)
2) MPCE
3) MPCE--NG

I'm not sure about difference, MPCE I believe got better oscillator
for timing and I think more linecard cpu dram for higher subscriber
scale. I don't know what NG got.

I wouldn't be surprised if they were also respins with newer Trio, as
cost reduction (E==1.5? NG==2.0?).

I'd also love to have definitive answer of changelog between each generation.

Post by Rolf Hanßen
Hello,
https://www.juniper.net/documentation/en_US/release-independent/junos/topics/reference/general/mpc-mx-series-mpc2e-features.html
regards
Rolf

Post by Kevin Wormington
Hi list,
Can anyone tell me the differences in scaling or features of the
MPC2E-3D-NG-R-B vs MPC2E-3D-R-B. I know the NG requires an SBCE2.
Thanks,
Kevin
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[Pavel Lunin]

Hi,

If memory serves, MPC2-NG is much like MPC3-NG: one MPC5-like PFE inside. A
good question is what is the difference between the MPC2-NG and MPC3-NG...
I'll let the astute readers figure it out on their own.

Old MPC2 non-NG is the "first generation Trio"-based card: two PFE, one per
MIC. There is no much sens in buying it today, it's a 10-years old thing.

E vs. non-E - Saku is (as always) right, the non-E was the very very first
generation of MPC cards, which had a kind of broken oscillator (only
matters for SyncE applications). So we normally omit the E in every day
language today, as all MPC cards are E since many many years.

And yeah, "HQoS" (aka -Q/EQ version of cards) has nothing to do with the
NG/non-NG story. Most cards have a -Q version to support "HQoS". Shortly
speaking, it's for those folks who don't know what to do with their
employer's money.

--
Pavel

Post by Saku Ytti
Hey Rolf,
No that's not it, that's difference between Q and non Q card. All
1) MPC (Trio 1.0)
2) MPCE
3) MPCE--NG
I'm not sure about difference, MPCE I believe got better oscillator
for timing and I think more linecard cpu dram for higher subscriber
scale. I don't know what NG got.
I wouldn't be surprised if they were also respins with newer Trio, as
cost reduction (E==1.5? NG==2.0?).
I'd also love to have definitive answer of changelog between each generation.

Post by Rolf Hanßen
Hello,

https://www.juniper.net/documentation/en_US/release-independent/junos/topics/reference/general/mpc-mx-series-mpc2e-features.html

Post by Rolf Hanßen
regards
Rolf

Post by Kevin Wormington
Hi list,
Can anyone tell me the differences in scaling or features of the
MPC2E-3D-NG-R-B vs MPC2E-3D-R-B. I know the NG requires an SBCE2.
Thanks,
Kevin
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--
++ytti
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[Andrey Kostin]

Hi Pavel,

HQoS is needed for subscriber aggregation, exactly for the case that is
discussed in another thread "Juniper buffer float".
NG cards without HQoS can be configured for "flexible mode" which is
HQoS limited to 32k queues. It's suitable for example if you have some
number of vlans and want to do per-vlan shaping and queueing. For
example, 32k queues with 4 queue per interface will allow to serve 8000
subinterfaces. On MPC2E-NG it means that you can do per-vlan QoS on 8
10G ports with 1000 vlans on each port - not bad in compare with old
non-NG non-Q cards that can do queueing only on physical interfaces. It
will work for small-scale LNS, up to 8k subscribers, but watch out to
not exceed it ;)
Full-scale NG HQoS card allows 512k queues that allows (in theory) to
terminate 64k subscribers with 8 queues per interface.

Kind regards,
Andrey

Post by Pavel Lunin
Hi,
If memory serves, MPC2-NG is much like MPC3-NG: one MPC5-like PFE inside. A
good question is what is the difference between the MPC2-NG and MPC3-NG...
I'll let the astute readers figure it out on their own.
Old MPC2 non-NG is the "first generation Trio"-based card: two PFE, one per
MIC. There is no much sens in buying it today, it's a 10-years old thing.
E vs. non-E - Saku is (as always) right, the non-E was the very very first
generation of MPC cards, which had a kind of broken oscillator (only
matters for SyncE applications). So we normally omit the E in every day
language today, as all MPC cards are E since many many years.
And yeah, "HQoS" (aka -Q/EQ version of cards) has nothing to do with the
NG/non-NG story. Most cards have a -Q version to support "HQoS". Shortly
speaking, it's for those folks who don't know what to do with their
employer's money.
--
Pavel

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[Pavel Lunin]

This post might be inappropriate. Click to display it.

[Mark Tinka]

Post by Pavel Lunin
But no matter how much it costs in CAPEX, HQoS is still complex as hell,
even if you have money to pay those cards. So only use it if you really
know what you are doing, otherwise it will make more harm than good (I have
examples, if you wish).

Totally agree with this last bit.

I think all our Juniper line cards support H-QoS. But to be honest, we
don't even smell that surface, never mind scratch it.

Mark.
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[Roger Wiklund]

High level diff:

MPC2E
***@40G each
No IR license mode (all features but 32VRF limit per MPC)
Minimum Junos 11.2R4

MPC2E-NG
***@80G
IR license mode available
Minimum Junos 14.1R4
Requires SCBE or SCBE2

More details here about specific features: (dynamic power, flexible
queueing, hqos, l2tp etc)
https://www.juniper.net/documentation/en_US/release-independent/junos/topics/reference/general/mpc-mx-series-mpc2e-features.html

/Roger

Post by Saku Ytti
Hey Rolf,
No that's not it, that's difference between Q and non Q card. All
1) MPC (Trio 1.0)
2) MPCE
3) MPCE--NG
I'm not sure about difference, MPCE I believe got better oscillator
for timing and I think more linecard cpu dram for higher subscriber
scale. I don't know what NG got.
I wouldn't be surprised if they were also respins with newer Trio, as
cost reduction (E==1.5? NG==2.0?).
I'd also love to have definitive answer of changelog between each generation.

Post by Rolf Hanßen
Hello,

https://www.juniper.net/documentation/en_US/release-independent/junos/topics/reference/general/mpc-mx-series-mpc2e-features.html

Post by Rolf Hanßen
regards
Rolf

Post by Kevin Wormington
Hi list,
Can anyone tell me the differences in scaling or features of the
MPC2E-3D-NG-R-B vs MPC2E-3D-R-B. I know the NG requires an SBCE2.
Thanks,
Kevin
_______________________________________________
https://puck.nether.net/mailman/listinfo/juniper-nsp

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--
++ytti
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[a***@netconsultings.com]

Kevin Wormington
Sent: Friday, October 19, 2018 6:29 PM
Hi list,
Can anyone tell me the differences in scaling or features of the MPC2E-3D-
NG-R-B vs MPC2E-3D-R-B. I know the NG requires an SBCE2.
Thanks,

Without going into too much detail (again),

If all your traffic is single class (like internet) then Trio gen 1 and gen
1.5 (old numbering scheme) are ok.

If however you have traffic of different priorities then you have two
options,
1) either you can make sure you will under no circumstances overload the
MPC2E card -which is kind of hard without custom script checking for PFE
utilization. (rule of thumb imix type of traffic is ok @20Gbps per PFE with
HQOS -i.e. QX chip enabled)
2) or you'll get Trio gen 2, which is ok and since 17.2, if I remember
correctly, can be completely corrected with tuneable pre-classifier feature.
(but this is the thing you need to tune in asr9k as well in order to get QOS
working correctly).

So definitely, if you have the budget you want to stay with MPC2E-3D-NG or
MPC3E-3D-NG.
Also these cards have the good old and familiar 1xLU-1xMQ-1xQX architecture
no weird mutations of it.

adam

netconsultings.com
::carrier-class solutions for the telecommunications industry::

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